HOUSE OF COMMONS OF CANADA
37th PARLIAMENT, 2nd SESSION

JOURNALS

No. 130

Tuesday, September 30, 2003

10:00 a.m.

Prayers

Daily Routine Of Business

Tabling of Documents

The Speaker laid upon the Table, — Special Report of the Auditor General of Canada concerning the Office of the Privacy Commissioner of Canada, pursuant to the Auditor General Act, R.S. 1985, c. A-17, sbs. 8(2). — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-826-01. (Pursuant to Standing Order 108(3)(g), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Public Accounts)

Presenting Petitions

Pursuant to Standing Order 36, petitions certified correct by the Clerk of Petitions were presented as follows:

— by Mr. Breitkreuz (Yorkton—Melville) , thirty-three concerning abortion (Nos. 372-2048 to 372-2080).

Business of Supply

The Order was read for the consideration of the Business of Supply.

Mr. Nystrom (Regina—Qu'Appelle) , seconded by Ms. Wasylycia-Leis (Winnipeg North Centre) , moved, — That this House call upon the government to hold a referendum within one year to determine whether Canadians wish to replace the current electoral system with a system of proportional representation and, if so, to appoint a commission to consult Canadians on the preferred model of proportional representation and the process of implementation, with an implementation date no later than July 1, 2006.

Debate arose thereon.

Statements By Members

Pursuant to Standing Order 31, Members made statements.

Oral Questions

Pursuant to Standing Order 30(5), the House proceeded to Oral Questions.

Business of Supply

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Nystrom (Regina—Qu'Appelle) , seconded by Ms. Wasylycia-Leis (Winnipeg North Centre) , in relation to the Business of Supply.

The debate continued.

Tabling of Documents

Pursuant to Standing Order 28(2)(b), the Speaker laid upon the Table, — The House of Commons Calendar for the year 2004. — Sessional Paper No. 8527-372-14.

Business of Supply

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Nystrom (Regina—Qu'Appelle) , seconded by Ms. Wasylycia-Leis (Winnipeg North Centre) , in relation to the Business of Supply.

The debate continued.

Motions

By unanimous consent, it was ordered, — That, in relation to its study of relations with Muslim countries, a maximum of 14 members divided into several groups of the Standing Committee on Foreign Affairs and International Trade be authorized to travel to the Middle East and South Asia from October 13 to 26, 2003, and that the necessary staff do accompany the Committee.

Business of Supply

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Nystrom (Regina—Qu'Appelle) , seconded by Ms. Wasylycia-Leis (Winnipeg North Centre) , in relation to the Business of Supply.

The debate continued.

Motions

By unanimous consent, it was ordered, — That the deferred recorded divisions, scheduled for Wednesday, October 1, 2003, on the motion for second reading of Bill C-406, An Act to amend the Employment Insurance Act, and on motions M-392, M-288, M-387 and, if necessary, on motion M-83, be held at 5:45 p.m., the bells having rung at 5:30 p.m., and that after the said deferred recorded divisions have been taken, the House continue to sit for one hour in order to consider Government Orders.

Business of Supply

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Nystrom (Regina—Qu'Appelle) , seconded by Ms. Wasylycia-Leis (Winnipeg North Centre) , in relation to the Business of Supply.

The debate continued.

At 5:15 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 81(16), the Speaker interrupted the proceedings.

The question was put on the motion and it was negatived on the following division:

(Division No. 222 -- Vote n^o 222)
YEAS: 76, NAYS: 144

YEAS -- POUR
Ablonczy Bachand (Saint-Jean) Bailey Bourgeois Breitkreuz Burton Cadman Cardin Casson Chatters Cummins Dalphond-Guiral Davies Desjarlais Desrochers Duceppe Duncan Epp Fitzpatrick	Forseth Fournier Gagnon (Québec) Gallant Gaudet Gauthier Girard-Bujold Godin Goldring Grewal Grey Guay Guimond Hanger Harper Hill (Prince George--Peace River) Hill (Macleod) Johnston Jordan	Kenney (Calgary Southeast) Lalonde Lanctôt Lill Loubier Lunney (Nanaimo—Alberni) Martin (Esquimalt--Juan de Fuca) Martin (Winnipeg Centre) Masse Mayfield McDonough Meredith Mills (Red Deer) Minna Moore Nystrom Pankiw Paquette Perron	Picard (Drummond) Proctor Rajotte Reid (Lanark—Carleton) Robinson Roy Sauvageau Schmidt Skelton Solberg St-Hilaire Stinson Stoffer Strahl Toews Wasylycia-Leis White (Langley--Abbotsford) White (North Vancouver) Yelich -- 76

NAYS -- CONTRE
Alcock Allard Assadourian Augustine Bagnell Bakopanos Barnes (Gander—Grand Falls) Barnes (London West) Barrette Bélair Bellemare Benoit Bertrand Bevilacqua Binet Blondin-Andrew Bonin Borotsik Boudria Bradshaw Brison Bryden Byrne Calder Cannis Caplan Carignan Carroll Casey Catterall Charbonneau Chrétien Coderre Collenette Comuzzi Copps	Cullen Cuzner Dion Discepola Doyle Drouin Duplain Efford Eggleton Eyking Farrah Finlay Folco Fontana Gallaway Godfrey Goodale Graham Grose Guarnieri Harvard Harvey Hearn Herron Hubbard Ianno Jackson Jennings Jobin Karetak-Lindell Keddy (South Shore) Keyes Kilgour (Edmonton Southeast) Knutson Kraft Sloan Lastewka	LeBlanc Lee Leung Longfield MacAulay MacKay (Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough) Macklin Mahoney Malhi Maloney Manley Mark Marleau Martin (LaSalle--Émard) Matthews McCallum McCormick McGuire McKay (Scarborough East) McLellan McTeague Mitchell Murphy Myers Nault Neville Normand O'Brien (Labrador) O'Brien (London--Fanshawe) O'Reilly Pacetti Pagtakhan Paradis Patry Penson Peric	Peschisolido Pettigrew Pickard (Chatham--Kent Essex) Pillitteri Pratt Price Provenzano Redman Reed (Halton) Regan Robillard Saada Schellenberger Scherrer Scott Sgro Shepherd Simard Sorenson St-Jacques St-Julien St. Denis Steckle Szabo Telegdi Thibault (West Nova) Thibeault (Saint-Lambert) Tirabassi Tonks Ur Valeri Vanclief Wayne Whelan Wilfert Wood -- 144

PAIRED -- PAIRÉS
Anderson (Victoria) Asselin Bigras Cauchon	Dhaliwal Easter Gagnon (Lac-Saint-Jean—Saguenay) Gagnon (Champlain)	Laframboise Marceau Ménard	Owen Paradis Rock

Deferred Recorded Divisions

Government Orders

Pursuant to Order made Thursday, September 25, 2003, the House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Boudria (Minister of State and Leader of the Government in the House of Commons) , seconded by Mr. Pagtakhan (Minister of Veterans Affairs) , — That Bill C-34, An Act to amend the Parliament of Canada Act (Ethics Commissioner and Senate Ethics Officer) and other Acts in consequence, be now read a third time and do pass.

The House proceeded to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the amendment of Mr. Forseth (New Westminster—Coquitlam—Burnaby) , seconded by Mr. Epp (Elk Island) , — That the motion be amended by deleting all the words after the word “That” and substituting the following:

“Bill C-34, An Act to amend the Parliament of Canada Act (Ethics Commissioner and Senate Ethics Officer) and other Acts in consequence, be not now read a third time but be referred back to the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs for the purpose of reconsidering Clause 4 with the view to ensure that:

(a) a standing or “an all party” committee of the House of Commons search for those persons who would be most suitably qualified and fit to hold the office of Ethics Commissioner; and

(b) the said committee recommend to the House of Commons the name of a person to hold such office.”.

The question was put on the amendment and it was negatived on the following division:

(Division No. 223 -- Vote n^o 223)
YEAS: 96, NAYS: 131

YEAS -- POUR
Ablonczy Anderson (Cypress Hills—Grasslands) Bachand (Saint-Jean) Bailey Barnes (Gander—Grand Falls) Benoit Bergeron Borotsik Bourgeois Breitkreuz Brison Burton Cadman Cardin Casey Casson Chatters Clark Crête Cummins Dalphond-Guiral Davies Desjarlais Desrochers	Doyle Duceppe Duncan Epp Fitzpatrick Forseth Fournier Gagnon (Québec) Gallant Gaudet Gauthier Girard-Bujold Godin Goldring Grewal Grey Guay Guimond Hanger Harper Hearn Herron Hill (Macleod) Hill (Prince George--Peace River)	Johnston Keddy (South Shore) Kenney (Calgary Southeast) Lalonde Lanctôt Lill Loubier Lunney (Nanaimo—Alberni) MacKay (Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough) Mark Martin (Winnipeg Centre) Martin (Esquimalt--Juan de Fuca) Masse Mayfield McDonough Meredith Mills (Red Deer) Moore Nystrom Pankiw Paquette Penson Perron Picard (Drummond)	Plamondon Proctor Rajotte Reid (Lanark—Carleton) Robinson Rocheleau Roy Sauvageau Schellenberger Schmidt Skelton Solberg Sorenson St-Hilaire Stinson Stoffer Strahl Toews Tremblay Wasylycia-Leis Wayne White (Langley--Abbotsford) White (North Vancouver) Yelich -- 96

NAYS -- CONTRE
Alcock Allard Assadourian Augustine Bagnell Bakopanos Barnes (London West) Barrette Bélair Bellemare Bertrand Bevilacqua Binet Blondin-Andrew Bonin Boudria Bradshaw Bryden Byrne Calder Cannis Caplan Carignan Carroll Catterall Charbonneau Chrétien Coderre Collenette Comuzzi Copps Cullen Cuzner	Dion Discepola Drouin Duplain Efford Eggleton Eyking Farrah Finlay Folco Fontana Gallaway Godfrey Goodale Graham Grose Guarnieri Harvard Harvey Hubbard Ianno Jackson Jennings Jobin Jordan Karetak-Lindell Keyes Kilgour (Edmonton Southeast) Knutson Kraft Sloan Lastewka LeBlanc Lee	Leung Longfield MacAulay Macklin Mahoney Malhi Maloney Manley Marleau Martin (LaSalle--Émard) Matthews McCallum McCormick McGuire McKay (Scarborough East) McLellan McTeague Minna Mitchell Murphy Myers Nault Neville Normand O'Brien (Labrador) O'Brien (London--Fanshawe) O'Reilly Pacetti Pagtakhan Paradis Patry Peric Peschisolido	Pettigrew Pickard (Chatham--Kent Essex) Pillitteri Pratt Price Provenzano Redman Reed (Halton) Regan Robillard Saada Scherrer Scott Sgro Shepherd Simard St-Jacques St-Julien St. Denis Steckle Szabo Telegdi Thibault (West Nova) Thibeault (Saint-Lambert) Tirabassi Tonks Ur Valeri Vanclief Whelan Wilfert Wood -- 131

PAIRED -- PAIRÉS
Anderson (Victoria) Asselin Bigras Cauchon	Dhaliwal Easter Gagnon (Champlain) Gagnon (Lac-Saint-Jean—Saguenay)	Laframboise Marceau Ménard	Owen Paradis Rock

Pursuant to Order made Thursday, September 25, 2003, the House proceeded to the taking of the deferred recorded division on the motion of Mr. Manley (Minister of Finance) , seconded by Ms. Caplan (Minister of National Revenue) , — That Bill C-48, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act (natural resources), be now read a second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Finance.

The question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following division:

(Division No. 224 -- Vote n^o 224)
YEAS: 188, NAYS: 39

YEAS -- POUR
Ablonczy Alcock Allard Anderson (Cypress Hills—Grasslands) Assadourian Augustine Bagnell Bailey Bakopanos Barnes (London West) Barnes (Gander—Grand Falls) Barrette Bélair Bellemare Benoit Bertrand Bevilacqua Binet Blondin-Andrew Bonin Borotsik Boudria Bradshaw Breitkreuz Brison Bryden Burton Byrne Cadman Calder Cannis Caplan Carignan Carroll Casey Casson Catterall Charbonneau Chatters Chrétien Clark Coderre Collenette Comuzzi Copps Cullen Cummins	Cuzner Dion Discepola Doyle Drouin Duncan Duplain Efford Eggleton Epp Eyking Farrah Finlay Fitzpatrick Folco Fontana Forseth Gallant Gallaway Godfrey Goldring Goodale Graham Grewal Grey Grose Guarnieri Hanger Harper Harvard Harvey Hearn Herron Hill (Macleod) Hill (Prince George--Peace River) Hubbard Ianno Jackson Jennings Jobin Johnston Jordan Karetak-Lindell Keddy (South Shore) Kenney (Calgary Southeast) Keyes Kilgour (Edmonton Southeast)	Knutson Kraft Sloan Lastewka LeBlanc Lee Leung Longfield Lunney (Nanaimo—Alberni) MacAulay MacKay (Pictou—Antigonish—Guysborough) Macklin Mahoney Malhi Maloney Manley Mark Marleau Martin (LaSalle--Émard) Martin (Esquimalt--Juan de Fuca) Matthews Mayfield McCallum McCormick McGuire McKay (Scarborough East) McLellan McTeague Meredith Mills (Red Deer) Minna Mitchell Moore Murphy Myers Nault Neville Normand O'Brien (Labrador) O'Brien (London--Fanshawe) O'Reilly Pacetti Pagtakhan Pankiw Paradis Patry Penson Peric	Peschisolido Pettigrew Pickard (Chatham--Kent Essex) Pillitteri Pratt Price Provenzano Rajotte Redman Reed (Halton) Regan Reid (Lanark—Carleton) Robillard Saada Schellenberger Scherrer Schmidt Scott Sgro Shepherd Simard Skelton Solberg Sorenson St-Jacques St-Julien St. Denis Steckle Stinson Strahl Szabo Telegdi Thibault (West Nova) Thibeault (Saint-Lambert) Tirabassi Toews Tonks Ur Valeri Vanclief Wayne Whelan White (Langley--Abbotsford) White (North Vancouver) Wilfert Wood Yelich -- 188

NAYS -- CONTRE
Bachand (Saint-Jean) Bergeron Bourgeois Cardin Crête Dalphond-Guiral Davies Desjarlais Desrochers Duceppe	Fournier Gagnon (Québec) Gaudet Gauthier Girard-Bujold Godin Guay Guimond Lalonde Lanctôt	Lill Loubier Martin (Winnipeg Centre) Masse McDonough Nystrom Paquette Perron Picard (Drummond) Plamondon	Proctor Robinson Rocheleau Roy Sauvageau St-Hilaire Stoffer Tremblay Wasylycia-Leis -- 39

PAIRED -- PAIRÉS
Anderson (Victoria) Asselin Bigras Cauchon	Dhaliwal Easter Gagnon (Champlain) Gagnon (Lac-Saint-Jean—Saguenay)	Laframboise Marceau Ménard	Owen Paradis Rock

Accordingly, Bill C-48, An Act to amend the Income Tax Act (natural resources), was read the second time and referred to the Standing Committee on Finance.

Private Members' Business

At 5:57 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 30(7), the House proceeded to the consideration of Private Members' Business.

The House resumed consideration of the motion of Mr. Breitkreuz (Yorkton—Melville) , seconded by Mr. Casson (Lethbridge) , — That the Standing Committee on Health fully examine, study and report to Parliament on: (a) whether or not abortions are medically necessary for the purpose of maintaining health, preventing disease or diagnosing or treating an injury, illness or disability; and (b) the health risks for women undergoing abortions compared to women carrying their babies to full term. (Private Members' Business M-83)

The debate continued.

At 6:58 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 93(1), the Speaker interrupted the proceedings.

The question was put on the motion and, pursuant to Standing Order 93(1) and to Order made earlier today, the recorded division was deferred until Wednesday, October 1, 2003, at 5:30 p.m.

Returns and Reports Deposited with the Clerk of the House

Pursuant to Standing Order 32(1), papers deposited with the Clerk of the House were laid upon the Table as follows:

— by Mr. Cauchon (Minister of Justice) — Report on the applications for ministerial review (miscarriages of justice) for the year 2003, pursuant to the Criminal Code, S.C. 2002, c. 13, s. 71. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-827-01. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights)

— by Mr. Cauchon (Minister of Justice) — Reports of the Law Commission of Canada for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Access to Information Act and to the Privacy Act, R.S. 1985, c. A-1 and P-21, sbs. 72(2). — Sessional Paper No. 8561-372-863-01. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights)

— by Ms. Copps (Minister of Canadian Heritage) — Report of the National Capital Commission for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-160-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Ms. Copps (Minister of Canadian Heritage) — Report of the Canadian Museum of Civilization for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-161-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Ms. Copps (Minister of Canadian Heritage) — Report of the Canadian Museum of Nature for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20. s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-166-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Ms. Copps (Minister of Canadian Heritage) — Report of the National Gallery of Canada for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-167-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Ms. Copps (Minister of Canadian Heritage) — Report of the Canada Science and Technology Museum for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-170-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Mr. Easter (Solicitor General of Canada) — Report of the National DNA Data Bank of Canada for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the DNA Identification Act, S.C. 2000, c. 10, s. 12. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-777-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights)

— by Mr. Mahoney (Secretary of State (Selected Crown Corporations)) — Report of the Canada Lands Company Limited for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-630-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Mr. Mahoney (Secretary of State (Selected Crown Corporations)) — Report of the Queens Quay West Land Corporation for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-631-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Ms. Robillard (President of the Treasury Board) — Report of the President of the Treasury Board for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Alternative Fuels Act, S.C. 1995, c. 20, s. 8. — Sessional Paper No. 8560-372-648-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Environment and Sustainable Development)

— by Mr. Thibault (Minister of Fisheries and Oceans) — Response of the government, pursuant to Standing Order 109, to the 15th report of the Standing Committee on Public Accounts (Chapter 2 of the December 2002 Report of the Auditor General of Canada — Fisheries and Oceans Canada: Contributing to Safe and Efficient Marine Navigation) (Sessional Paper No. 8510-372-78), presented to the House on Wednesday, May 14, 2003. — Sessional Paper No. 8512-372-78.

— by Ms. Whelan (Minister for International Cooperation) — Reports of the Canadian International Development Agency for the fiscal year ended March 31, 2003, pursuant to the Access to Information Act and to the Privacy Act, R.S. 1985, c. A-1 and P-21, sbs. 72(2). — Sessional Paper No. 8561-372-631-02. (Pursuant to Standing Order 32(5), permanently referred to the Standing Committee on Justice and Human Rights)

Adjournment

At 7:00 p.m., the Speaker adjourned the House until tomorrow at 2:00 p.m., pursuant to Standing Order 24(1).